PIT BULLS

So what about the poor 4 year old who's parents had the St bernard that was 6 or 8 years old and never bit anyone or showed any signs of aggression. Should people not care that she got almost 200 stitches in her heard b/c the dog snapped one day and bit her or would it being a pitbull have made people think different. Certain things are bred into dogs as humans and each humans and dogs snap at different things. Being bred to hunt in a dogs bloodline is no different that say alcoholism or drugs being bred into a humans bloodline. I still stand behind human interaction. My 7 yr old boxer is 115lbs and can be very aggressive if he wanted. He like my english bull both fear having there behinds beat one good time. He knows when to be aggresive ( when my house is vacant and he's there) when to position himself between me and other people he has not yet met and is unsure of and when to let the 2 year olds pull his floppy jaws until he can get loose and go elsewhere to lay. I''ll flatout say he's got one of the best dispositions of any dog you'll meet but he's been handraised since he was 6 weeks old.
 
ANy dog can get pissed at anything

when I was 18 a Yellow Lab bit my hand ( I mean BIT ) torn holes in my hand just because he thought I was going to take his bone.. all I was doing was walking by and picked up a paint brush that was 10 feet away from his bone.. but I was between him and his bone when it happened...

I did not even know he had a bone on the ground.. so any dog can atatck for any reason..
 
I look at it like the nature versus nurture debate on child rearing. I think most would agree that both have an influence on how a kid turns out. It's not "all in how they're raised." I've seen families where you get extremely different outcomes when the parents did their best to treat all the kids the same.

Same thing with dogs. There's a genetic component. You can't put your fingers in you ears like a 3rd grader and go "la la la" when someone mentions dog bite statistics. On the flipside you can't ignore how they've been treated. I'm sure you folks with pit bulls for pets have treated them well and they, in turn, treat you well. That doesn't mean that the general public shouldn't be more cautious about some breeds than others. My neighbor's pack of territorial toy poodles are a mere annoyance, if they were pitbulls it would be different.
 
A dog (not puppy) will only act in a manner that it has deemed acceptable from the reactions of its owner. If you let your dog piss on the floor than he will do it. Just as if you let your pit bull go in to tense mode when new people are around then you the owner are putting others at risk; not the dog. Well reared dogs act with in the range of behavior they are shown is accepted because they are not humans and dont reason for themselves like we do. The is why comparing them to raising children does not fully apply. A child does wrong because it has decided it accepts the outcome from doing so. A dog acts poorly because it feels it's allowed to.
 
CJ2YJ2TJ said:
A dog (not puppy) will only act in a manner that it has deemed acceptable from the reactions of its owner. If you let your dog piss on the floor than he will do it. Just as if you let your pit bull go in to tense mode when new people are around then you the owner are putting others at risk; not the dog. Well reared dogs act with in the range of behavior they are shown is accepted because they are not humans and dont reason for themselves like we do. The is why comparing them to raising children does not fully apply. A child does wrong because it has decided it accepts the outcome from doing so. A dog acts poorly because it feels it's allowed to.
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That's interesting. I'm certainly no dog expert. I find it hard to believe that training could cover every possible situation a dog may find itself in and that there's no stimulus that wouldn't trigger some pathway in his brain that would prouduce undesirable results.

It happened to Sigfried and Roy, right?

Some local guy lost it and chopped off his daughter's head.

My point being that nothing is 100% trained or under control.

As far as people go, people vary. Do you believe we're each different? Not appearance. I mean behavior, moods, thinking patterns. You think all that is training? I think dogs vary regardless of the human's attempts to control and train them. Some are more energetic, some are naturally curious, some naturally agressive, some naturally shy. You see a litter of puppies and they act differently. That isn't due to training.

Frankly, I don't have a dog in this fight. (pun intended) I just think it's an interesting topic. A saw my dog get chased by a cat once, so I think she's on the opposite end of the scale from a pit. Maybe I should start her on an agression plan to bring her up to standard.

OOPS. I see you said "dog (not puppy)." I do agree with you for the most part. Dog's are very trainable. I just think there's some inborn stuff that can't be trained out. I could be wrong.
 
or maybe we should kill any cat we may save because they can be agressive too...

Thats based on some peoples opinion on this subject... I have recieved much more pain from an angry pissed off cat then any dog
 
This is KB...He's as tough as they come:shaking:
The rotty is my sister's 6 month old pup Lilly...
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The IG is our 4 and a half year old alpha dog Vinny...
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And this is Greyson my 5 year old nephew who has the rotty pup...
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Boarder Collie's were breed to heard sheep, a very aggressive animal. The breed is known to nip and bite small children and sometimes cause great harm to them. Does this mean society should "do away" with this breed also?
 
I've fostered and worked with dogs, including several terrier mixes, and never met one I didn't like. I have to say that the worst part about any statistics on the issue is the fact that many dogs of mixed parentage are generically deemed 'pit bulls' when no one can figure it out. Funny thing, in rescue when no one can figure it out they get to be 'lab mixes.' Everybody has a story and it can be about any breed or any size dog. A girl I knew in HS had her face torn up by a Llassa Apso.

Control is the biggest issue... with any dog. Raising them right to know who is in charge and to expose them to any and all possible situations. The biggest mistake people make is to trust a dog (ANY DOG) to know what to do; they're pack animals and look to the leader for guidance and you have to be that leader. You can't put a dog in a situation where you set him up to fail. My lab mix is almost 4 and she impresses me all the time with how well she behaves and adjusts to so many different situations. But I don't trust her to behave... I'm careful and I watch her and I keep her leashed so I'm in control. If a situation gets iffy, I make sure she knows that I'm in charge and I say how she should behave.

It's interesting to hear all the stories of 6-10 year-old dogs of various breeds attacking a child when there had never been a problem. When things suddenly happen like this, there is most likely a medical reason. Sick animals are dangerous animals.

I had a neighbor's Great Dane come across the road after me when he'd never even tried to leave his invisible fence much less barked when we'd walk by his house for years. Fortunately for me, a car came at that exact moment and he was hit in the process of crossing the road to attack me. He probably weighed as much as me at 17 and I would not have fared well if he'd made it across that 20' of asphalt.
 
Not everyone can raise a dog properly. It's sad but true. And even less have the ability to further train one.
 
PrdsOffroadnJT said:
Not everyone can raise a dog properly. It's sad but true. And even less have the ability to further train one.
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Very true. Its an everyday job. My dog is far from perfect but he definately improves consistantly and I am not fearful of him attacking. Sadly I find alot of people are fearful of him when I am in public because he is a wideheaded 90 lb boxer that doesnt have his ear cropped so a majority of people mistake him for a pit .
 
CJ2YJ2TJ said:
Very true. Its an everyday job. My dog is far from perfect but he definately improves consistantly and I am not fearful of him attacking. Sadly I find alot of people are fearful of him when I am in public because he is a wideheaded 90 lb boxer that doesnt have his ear cropped so a majority of people mistake him for a pit .
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So you have that problem also huh
 
BoltOnJohn said:
Look here :
http://dogbitelaw.com/breeds-causing-DBRFs.pdf
Looks like ...
Pitbulls 118
Collies 6
I see a difference in relative danger.
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We've beat this statistics argument to death.
My neighbors Pomeranian bites me 3 times a week. (not playful mind you i get out of the car she runs into my yard barking attacks my feet and I punt her (occaisonally)

This is never reported mind you because she is too small to do harm. If my other neighbor's pit (who SHOULD be put down, as he took him from his son who was fighting him and now has him double chained to a tree and throws food his way cuz he is scared of his own dog and never pets him, yet animal control wont do anything :shaking: ) were to bite me 1x it would make the statistics.

BTW Collies <> Order Collies. Different breed actually different Genus, but mistakenly same common name...
 
Futbalfantic said:
Boarder Collie's were breed to heard sheep, a very aggressive animal. The breed is known to nip and bite small children and sometimes cause great harm to them. Does this mean society should "do away" with this breed also?
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DAMN STRAIGHT !!!! My mom has a rescue dog, a border collie we've dubbed 'Bitter' she has bitten my brothers heel/shin hard 2-3 times. Nipped at me twice and bitten my late dog buddy just for sniffer her.. Her vet said she is a 'fear biter' as she was an abused dog. She is a true herd dog, its sad you can tell she struggles with her fear of men yet her instinct to circle and round up everyone to the point of being a nuisance.

meow... meow..... can we talk about cats now... I've got 1 that turns on the bathroom light and fan when she wants food...
 
1. I didn't start this thread to bash anyone, and i don't like the name calling. I just wanted to show a little support for a misunderstood breed.
2. I agree that all animals (people included) can be unpredictable and dangerous at times.
3. Statistics are easily skewed to prove points.
4. Here's a "statistic" for you. 2665 video results found on you tube for "pit bulls". Browse through, there are alot of good dogs that you never see on statistic sheets.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=pit+bulls&search=Search
5. Never thought this thread would take off like this. I'd hate to see the guy that comes to one of your houses and tries to take your dog. Noticed a few avatars changed today! haha
 
chuckwhut said:
5. Never thought this thread would take off like this. I'd hate to see the guy that comes to one of your houses and tries to take your dog. Noticed a few avatars changed today! haha
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Haha...forget what I would do, worry about the dog. Dogs have an amazing ability to tell the difference between "new friends" and "unwanted intruders".
 
yeah Duke would'nt appreciate it..

and yeah i changed mine.. i like seeing my dog everytime i post
 
Lets just save the touble of making any PB haters angry, and call them american staffordshires. It worked for the akc, and this is what they seem to do at animal shelters. I had to school an shelter employee onc because she refused to admit that amstaffs and pits are different. Their really not.

I do regretfully have to say that I did recently get rid of my long time friend, roxy. She bit my son, 3 times. Just some advice, after a pit claims a master, that's it, so have your kids first. She was awesome and will be missed.
 
and we are talking about pits?

NCJeepin said:
Yeah, you're right. They have just been used to fight, among other things, since 1835.
Place Ban Status
Royal City, Washington[1] Active: 12 Jan, 2007
Denver, Colorado [2] Active: Banned on 9 May, 2005 (first banned in 1980's)
Ontario, Canada[3] Active: Banned on 15 October, 2004
Winnipeg, Canada[4] Active: Banned in 1990
Prince George's County, Maryland[5] Active: 1996
Shelbyville, California[6] Proposed: 18 November, 2006
New York City, NY[7] Proposed: 28 December 2006
Aurora, Colorado[8] Proposed: 27 September, 2005
Oklahoma [9] Proposed 21 June, 2005
Youngstown, Ohio[10] Proposed: 10 January, 1999
Richland, Washington[1] Proposed: 21 December, 2006
Tupelo, Mississippi[11] Proposed: 28 September, 2006
Parker, Colorado[12] Proposed: 17 January, 2006
Chicago, Illinois[13] Proposed: 17 November, 2005
Independence , Missouri [14] Proposed: 19 June, 2006
France[15] Active: April 30, 1999; Ownership restricted; non-pure-breed animals resembling pit-bulls are to be surgically neutered
United Kingdom[16] Active: 12 August, 1991 (Banned in public places, under the Dangerous Dogs Act 1991)
Why would these locations want to ban a dog who merely pulls things on the farm?? I guess they must be ignorant too....
I think you've been riding in a Jeep too long, its wearing off on you
Those issues are brought up by ignorant folks like some on here that don't know all the facts before coming down with a case of oral diarea...
QUOTE]I am usally a well mannered decent tempered person on this board, and this as really struck a nerve with me... I am sorry if i seem rude or callis but i am just tired of people not knowing what they are talking about.... Nothing personal....:flipoff2:[/ please don't bite:shaking:
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I am just a casual lurker on this board but this thread caught my eye and I felt the need to add my .02:

I rescued a Pit about 6 yrs ago and had him for four yrs (lost him 2 yrs ago to a Bobcat) and he, honestly, was the best dog I have ever owned. Sweet, lovable, caring, etc, even at 100 lbs. He absolutely adored my oldest child (second one had not been born yet) and would take any "abuse" she could dish out (hair pulling, using him as a pillow, riding him like a horse, etc). He would only sleep in her room and was antsy when she spent the night at Grandma's house. In fact, he would let us know when my daughter was getting sick by not letting anyone into her room except me (he would stand between the door and my wife, trying to keep her out). He was never animal aggressive, either with our 7 yr old (at the time) Jack Russell or any of the neighborhood dogs or cats. All he cared about was getting love and attention. The only time he would show aggression was when someone would try to enter the house "uninvited" (we lived in a bad part of town originally). Then, and only then, would he show his aggressive side. I would absolutely own another one and am actively trying to convince the wife to get another one (she is only balking because we do not have a fenced in yard right now). I have also known 7 other Pits, all of whom were gentle and loving (even two that were rescued fighting dogs).

On the other hand, I have been viciously attacked by 6 German Shephards (one almost caused me to lose an eye), 2 Dobermans, 2 Labs, and even a Poodle (which required 7 stitches in my face). Do I personally think that these dogs are more "inherently" dangerous than a Pit? No. Do I personally feel that these attacks were the results of their genetic code? No. Do I personally feel that the attacks were directly related to the owner's handling of the dogs? Absolutely.

All dogs, regardless of breed, take their cues from their pack leaders and will act accordingly. Houdini and others have said it best when they said that it is not the dog's fault but the owner's.

Sorry for the rambling. You can now go back to your regularly scheduled programming. ;-)
 
chuckwhut said:
1. I didn't start this thread to bash anyone, and i don't like the name calling. I just wanted to show a little support for a misunderstood breed.
2. I agree that all animals (people included) can be unpredictable and dangerous at times.
3. Statistics are easily skewed to prove points.
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I totally agree, and as I stated earlier, I should not have made the statement that I made in the "free" post. It was originally a joke because of what I have seen personally.

I am glad that you all have such a strong passion for the breed! I wish you all the best with the animal(s) that own or plan to own someday. Now that we have beat this topic to death (no pun intended)....can we move on?
 
andysleds said:
I totally agree, and as I stated earlier, I should not have made the statement that I made in the "free" post. It was originally a joke because of what I have seen personally.
I am glad that you all have such a strong passion for the breed! I wish you all the best with the animal(s) that own or plan to own someday. Now that we have beat this topic to death (no pun intended)....can we move on?
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I dont know you personally Andy, but I appreciate your previous comment. I think its a good way to let this thread end also. I think most all of us had our say, whether we agree or not.
 
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