"Not for Hire"?

Caver Dave

Caver Dave

Just holdin' it down here in BFV
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Over the years, I've noticed "Not for Hire" on both towrigs & trailers.
I assumed it was for advertising you're not hauling "commercially" (but a personally owned vehicle), or maybe to skip certain weigh stations (outside of NC)?
Several of the folks north of the border (VA) told me it's "required" in other states?

So, school me on why this is/isn't needed... for trip out west to say, Moab or Disney?
 
The way it was explained to me was this, and this may be wrong, if you look like a Commercial Vehicle and you do not specifically have "not for hire" displayed you can be pulled and treated like a commercial vehicle. Including checking for log books, etc.

Almost impossible to prove you are not being paid under the table.

Decals are cheap.
 
I think it has something to do with your insurance carrier, can't remember from when a company I worked for had an option to do it but we were definitely for hire.
 
Still speculation, but I was told that if you had "not for hire" Then you don't need CDL ......

Just found this..sounds the most reasonable

As to the "Not for Hire" signs, this exempts you from certain road use taxes. It does not exempt you from having the proper class drivers license for the type of vehicle you are driving. You can not drive a big rig without that class of license. Many times, states will determine you are a commercial rig, i.e. for hire, if you have advertising on the side of your trailer or truck. I see this among my racing friends. The "toterhome" (seehttp://www.racingjunk.com/category/1...otorhomes.htmlfor examples) is popular among the richer teams. These are tractor trailer cabs with large living quarters built in towing a trailer only slightly smaller than a semi. These can be licensed as an RV and you don't even have to a big rig license. It also exempts you from the DOT record keeping for the driver logs. But these will get stopped as a commercial vehicle on occasion if they are plastered with the usual advertising.
 
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The NASCAR haulers all have "not for hire" on them, and they have to obey all rules, all licensing requirements, log books, etc. I don't think they're exempt from much...

I'll get an answer on this tomorrow if I remember.
 
"Not for hire" does not mean "not commercial vehicle". There are different rules for vehicles that haul cargo or people for money. Mostly more taxes.
 
The owner of CFS off-road has that stenciled on the side of his bobtailed International 4700 DT466. Basically to keep people from asking.
 
Ron said:
if you look like a Commercial Vehicle
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Guilty... but despite having to be run under a "commercial" insurance policy (the C&C VIN is different than pickups w/ beds) is 100% personally owned, not for business/Commerce, and has a regular16k# weighted NC tag...
20160427_114835.jpg

shawn said:
"Not for hire" does not mean "not commercial vehicle". There are different rules for vehicles that haul cargo or people for money. Mostly more taxes.
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Can you elaborate on that @shawn ?
 
He might be referring to the IFTA sticker truckers have to have. They also have to pay each state fuel taxes by miles run in that state IIRC. I work in transportation but don't drive. There are a lot of what is called "Hot Shot's" in the industry now that are basically 1 ton pickups with big trailers. We put a 16Klb coil on one today.
 
So I just asked someone who drives a not for hire rig, and he says the road use tax is different/cheaper because it's all private cargo, and they don't have to do a bill of lading for the contents and can go through inspection and weigh stations quicker and easier because of that. He said there are a few other minor points as well, but those are the major reasons. He has 48 state registration, because they sometimes have to take the long way to avoid major construction, etc., and already travel to/through a lot of states.
 
I'm not an authority on this but I did ask this question when I got my CDL a couple years back and the inspector laughed and said that basically it used to be a way around having to have a CDL for certain situations (race teams and farmers). This is now incorrect and he said the decal means nothing. His explanation was that it is all about the rating class of the truck, trailer and combination of both. 26,001# combo is CDL whether it is being used commercially or privately. 10,001# on the trailer rating and again it means you need a CDL.
Here is another scenario that I drove into hauling our class 5 desert buggies through New Mexico. The truck had a "not for hire" decal so I did not have a CDL (boss said I didn't need it). Got pulled into a scale house so I gave the same excuse about the not for hire decal so I didn't need a CDL. Inspector took one look at the decaled up buggies and said you are being sponsored so therefore there is "commerce" happening and now you are a commercial rig. My combo weight was way over my license anyway so they had me no matter what angle I gave them. I do pull race car/show cars in motorsports and so I know enough on this subject to be dangerous.lol It seems the only exemption that is still around is the RV.
 
bronco slim said:
I'm not an authority on this but I did ask this question when I got my CDL a couple years back and the inspector laughed and said that basically it used to be a way around having to have a CDL for certain situations (race teams and farmers). This is now incorrect and he said the decal means nothing.
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The decal does mean something, but it has nothing to do with a CDL. See my post above, per the people who drive them professionally. It's all about tax and cargo classification.
 
Yup. Clearly stated in NC Chapter 20, too.
 
bronco slim said:
His explanation was that it is all about the rating class of the truck, trailer and combination of both. 26,001# combo is CDL whether it is being used commercially or privately. 10,001# on the trailer rating and again it means you need a CDL.
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This is not completely true. If you are not hauling commercially, you can up your license to cover the weight and restrictions without getting a CDL.
 
bronco slim said:
Here is another scenario that I drove into hauling our class 5 desert buggies through New Mexico. The truck had a "not for hire" decal so I did not have a CDL (boss said I didn't need it). Got pulled into a scale house so I gave the same excuse about the not for hire decal so I didn't need a CDL. Inspector took one look at the decaled up buggies and said you are being sponsored so therefore there is "commerce" happening and now you are a commercial rig. My combo weight was way over my license anyway so they had me no matter what angle I gave them. I do pull race car/show cars in motorsports and so I know enough on this subject to be dangerous.lol It seems the only exemption that is still around is the RV.
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So what kind of penalty did you end up with?
 
paradisePWoffrd said:
This is not completely true. If you are not hauling commercially, you can up your license to cover the weight and restrictions without getting a CDL.
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Yes, non-commercial Class A/B/C license. People forget what CDL stands for. I believe @benmack1 has been through this process.
 
I have a Ford F38 , at least that's what the title says , My insurance company said it has a commercial VIN , and were charging me commercial insurance rates , I worked up a deal with them , slapped "not for hire" on the doors and got the truck insured as a "recreational vehicle " . Insurance went from $350 every six months to $147 every six months .
 
Dirt Mcgert said:
I have a Ford F38 , at least that's what the title says , My insurance company said it has a commercial VIN , and were charging me commercial insurance rates , I worked up a deal with them , slapped "not for hire" on the doors and got the truck insured as a "recreational vehicle " . Insurance went from $350 every six months to $147 every six months .
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I think that's a mid-90's C&C truck, right? :D

That's exactly what my insurance writer told me about the VIN on my C&C, and that it's have to be written on a separate "commercial policy" from the others.
 
paradisePWoffrd said:
This is not completely true. If you are not hauling commercially, you can up your license to cover the weight and restrictions without getting a CDL.
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This was exactly my initial discussion with the inspector in New Mexico. I said it was private toys owned by a buddy and we were wheelin in the desert. They all flew home to Vegas and I offered to drive. He was not buying that it was a private non commercial load solely on the buggies having decals all over them(sponsors =commerce=commercial load). I looked like us going wheelin but it was ultimately up to his discretion and he said no way you are a commercial load.
jeepinmatt said:
So what kind of penalty did you end up with?
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Oddly enough they showed extreme mercy on me, no tickets but we had to fly in a CDL driver the next morning to get me across the state and pay the border fee $33. They even let me take the whole rig to a hotel over night cause inspector didn't want to be responsible for the buggies overnight.
All of you have great responses and they make sense but I am only relating what I've been through. 2 separate inspectors told me the same thing about the not for hire. I wish yall would have been there to defend me when they were busting my balls but I was certainly in the wrong. lol Great info guys but I'm all legal now
 
jeepinmatt said:
Yes, non-commercial Class A/B/C license. People forget what CDL stands for. I believe @benmack1 has been through this process.
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Yep, non-CDL class A license. I pull a 16K fifth wheel camper with my ram dually, GCVWR is 30K (trailer is 16K, Truck is 14K). I don't weigh anywhere close to that but it's the door tag ratings that count for what DL you need. Plates are for actual weights. I doubt anyone gets pulled pulling a camper with a class C DL but it makes me legal and feel more comfortable. Same basic test as the main CDL (but less sections, no air etc) and a trivial road test which is much simpler than the actual CDL road test. Since my pickup has such a high GVWR, I can't even pull @tlucier 14K gooseneck flat bed without the non-CDL class A legally in NC.
 
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