6 Speed Versus 10 Speed Transmissions

Discussion in 'Tow Rigs and Trailers' started by NickMaul, Nov 4, 2019.

  1. NickMaul

    NickMaul Well-Known Member

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    Jul 4, 2009
    Location:
    Virginia Beach
    I’ve been doing some light research of new trucks coming in 2020. Been looking at a lot of Silverado and the F series trucks in both the half ton and 3/4 ton flavor (no diesel). The tow load in question would be my XJ so probably 8k loaded.

    Do we have any good indications that the 10 speed will be a winner in both daily driving and towing in hills?

    TIA :D


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  2. UTfball68

    UTfball68 Well-Known Member

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    Jul 18, 2008
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    Granite Quarry
    Nothing really to add, I like auto transmissions, but I think I've hit the crotchety old man point where new technology is bad technology and my ability to receive and process new automotive tech has plateaued. Like some of you boomers going from manual transmissions to auto or carbs to efi. For me, 6spd auto good...8spd auto, geez kids these days are getting wild...10spd auto, oh lawd, bet you like Florida Georgia Line too.
     
  3. jeepinmatt

    jeepinmatt Still Fat

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2005
    Location:
    Stanley, NC
    I'll take a 10 speed auto over a CVT any day. But like with all trannies through the years, it needs to have a solid design AND good programming.
     
  4. BigClay

    BigClay Well-Known Member

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    Winston-Salem
    I have nothing to add except I am glad you are going to tons because once you have the freedom to thrash on the XJ and be able to tow it home there is no telling how crazy you are going to get hahaha
     
  5. NickMaul

    NickMaul Well-Known Member

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    Hoping 2020 will be a big year for the XJ!


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  6. Tim C

    Tim C Wizard

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    Jan 22, 2007
    Location:
    Fayetteville
    Generally speaking the more gears the better the engine will stay in it's power band, that means better mpg and an easier tow. That said the more gears in my experience means the trans is shifting up and down more often to stay in the sweet spot. It's not necessarily a bad thing but guys used to a 4 speed that would hit 4th and lug until a hill don't seem to like it. They complain it's always hunting.

    I'm not a fan of autos generally but you don't have much choice anymore. That said the 6 speed in my 16 f250 is the best auto I've driven, I absolutely hate the shift strategy of the 6spd Allison in my dad's dmax.

    And more gears doesn't mean more complexity either really with an auto. I don't have the specs right off hand but the same planetary gear sets that give you 6 speeds may also give 8 or 5 depending on which parts of the plantary set you hold or turn. The older Ford 5 speed behind the 6.0 for example was actually a 6 speed. It would shift 12346 if trans temp was above 40 degrees and 12345 if below, just applying na different set of clutches. The difference in ratios was only like .08 or so.
     
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  7. NickMaul

    NickMaul Well-Known Member

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    That some good insight. As far as the gasser super duty, 2020 models can come with the 6.2liter/6 speed trans or a newer 7.3liter/10 speed trans. I am interested in test driving them as they come available. However I think they only plan to put the 7.3 liter gasser in an F350 SD.


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  8. 77GreenMachine

    77GreenMachine Phillip Talton

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    Trinity, NC
    That 7.3 gasser would be what I would want. I’m anxious to see some reviews about those engines. Not that I’ll be buying one in the next 20 years, just curious :D
     
  9. UTfball68

    UTfball68 Well-Known Member

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    I was a hater, and apparently didn't realize how big the 'heavy gasser' market had become. But, with more info coming out on the 7.3, I feel like they're setting us up for the ol turbo switcheroo like they did with the first 7.3. I personally feel the projected 7.3 numbers are a bit pedestrian for what's available and the ci, but looks like the ground work is there to sustain a mild turbo set up. If that's the case, I could see the diesel craze being over, and a 'muscle truck' era beginning.
     
  10. Tim C

    Tim C Wizard

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    Fayetteville
    This. I won't be surprised to see an Ecoboost super duty in a few years with a turbo 7.3 gasser.

    I like my 16 6.7 powerstroke, that thing will move anything you hitch to it with no effort and I haven't had any problems with emissions stuff (yet) but my next truck will be a 3/4 ton gasser. I like the heavier suspension and better brakes over a 1/2 ton but the diesels are getting too complicated and the fuel mileage doesn't make up for it. The new gassers are much stronger than they were 20 years ago.
     
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  11. 77GreenMachine

    77GreenMachine Phillip Talton

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    The fact that I will personally never spend more than $20k on a vehicle and also never purchase a brand new vehicle puts me in an older truck no matter what. Therefore, the fear of major repairs on diesel trucks pretty much rules them out for me. In a few years, I hope to have a gooseneck to put my camper on and at that point I’ll probably need a stronger truck as it might be more than my 6.0 Chevy wants to haul across mountains. Since Chevy quit making the 8.1 and only put the 6.2 in half tons, that leaves me with a newer 6.0 and 6 speed or a Ford.
    Gas trucks are just cheaper all around and easier to maintain and get parts in a pinch. Who knows what I’ll do when the time comes, but I agree gas trucks are starting to be really powerful and certainly reliable.

    As for transmissions and the original subject for this thread, my wifes van is a 6 speed and it tends to shift a lot on our hilly country roads. It used to bother me but I looked it up and it’s normal, just the nature of having more gears. It took some getting used to. Newer transmissions are made to shift and it doesn’t seem to hurt them.

    On the flipside, too much shifting and gear hunting in my 4L80E will build too much heat and kill it I fear. When/if I start towing a GN about 10k with that truck, I’ll put a bigger trans pan and tranny cooler on it and hope for the best. It will be slow and get 5mpg at that point though. That’s pretty awful fuel mileage for some of these 700 mile trips we take, fuel costs adds up fast!!
     
  12. paradisePWoffrd

    paradisePWoffrd Recovering Project Junkie

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    I was going to say this... My guess is that there aren't 10 gear sets but just a few with electronic clutching and converter settings.
     
  13. paradisePWoffrd

    paradisePWoffrd Recovering Project Junkie

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    Nov 5, 2005
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    Newton, NC
    I was talking to Aaron at TruDynoSports and he mentioned putting a turbo on a v10 excursion. It was wastegated at 15psi and made like 450hp and 700+ ftlbs on the chassis Dyno on pump gas. He said it reminded him of a diesel engine the way it ran and drove.


    Also, if you decide to get a newer 6.0 Chevy gas 2500, plan on getting a tune. The newer ones are turds.
     
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  14. NickMaul

    NickMaul Well-Known Member

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    Jul 4, 2009
    Location:
    Virginia Beach
    Right off of their website:

    "This electronically controlled transmission has selectable drive modes that include normal, tow/haul, eco, slippery, and deep sand and snow. The entire unit is so cleverly engineered that – even with four extra gears – it fits in the same space as the 6-speed and weighs only 3.5 pounds more."

    I suppose a 6 speed has become the new status quo...
     
  15. Tim C

    Tim C Wizard

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    Jan 22, 2007
    Location:
    Fayetteville
    So after snooping around Mitchell at work I've determined the 6r140 six speed from Ford uses 3 planetary gears, one simple driving a compound ravigneaux if you want to googleize that to figure out how it works, with only 5 clutches to get 6 forward and one reverse gear.

    Mitchell doesn't have much info on 2020 vehicles yet but the 10 speed in the f150 which is a 10r80 has 4 simple planetary gear sets and 6 clutches. From what I can tell it skips gears as needed 9 is a .636:1 ratio, 10th is a .689 and 8th is also an overdrive at .854 to 1

    It uses 9th as the top gear in tow haul or sport mode. And can drop from 10th to 5th on wot downshifts instead of dropping a gear or two at a time.
     
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  16. VortecJeep

    VortecJeep Powered by Uranium-235

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2005
    Location:
    Concord, NC
    The 10 speed trannys in the Ford and GMs are the same unit, only difference is in the computer.
    My 2018 F150 V8 has the 10 speed auto. In the 6 months I’ve had it, I still haven’t towed with it, but I like driving it. When it does downshift 1 gear for an incline, I don’t notice it unless I look at the instrument cluster and see what gear it is in.
    Most of the time under normal driving conditions, it skips enough gears that it probably only hits 5 or 6 of them going up from 1st to 10th.
    Sport mode is fun.
     
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  17. Croatan_Kid

    Croatan_Kid How's your hammer hangin'?

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2007
    Location:
    New Bern
    I'd love to drive a 2020 L5P Duramax with the 10 speed Allison...I bet it's amazing.

    I've driven an '18 F150 with a 5.0/10spd. Pretty awesome transmission, I gotta admit.
     

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